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The Eat at Joe's Kawai K5000 Message Board Digest
Using the Hidden Sequencer in the K5000S


Can I make my own "Demos" for the K5000s?
Monday, 20-Apr-98 19:38:07 writes:

     I was just answering a post concerning a problem I and others encountered playing
     the demo songs, and it hit me "like the kiss at the end of a wet fist." (Nick
     Danger, Third Eye)

     How can we make our own wonderful "Demo" songs that will play back upon booting
     the K5000S while holding down F1? I *KNOW* this must be
     possible! I will experiment... 

     I have recorded the output of the demo into my sequencer (four tracks, midi
     channels 1-4 used), and played them back to the K5000S successfully in Multi
     mode (AFTER setting the PRG Receive setting on the System/Midi page to "SEC").
     Tons of sysex data is included in this dump!!! :-) (Gee, can I use any of
     this setup data??? Wonder what it all is???) I will try a few disk-formats
     (PC, Q-80) to see if they are readible.

     Egads! These files are regular .MID files (readible by even Win95's Midi player!),
     and if you copy one to a blank PC formatted diskette and place it into your
     powered-down K5000S, then turn on the unit while holding down the F1 button,
     IT PLAYS -- IT PLAYS -- IT PLAYS!!!! 

     Is this an undocumented feature added to system 3.0????


     Terry Leigh Britton 


Re: Can I make my own "Demos" for the K5000s?
Monday, 20-Apr-98 20:47:54 writes:

     So you can use it live as a sequencer?

     Hmm . . . Will it send to other equipment? 


Re: Re: Can I make my own "Demos" for the K5000s?
Monday, 20-Apr-98 21:01:01 writes:

     Yes, it is thus a (playback-only) performance, or live, sequencer, and it DOES
     transmit data on at least the first four channels of standard midi kinds. So, it
     could conceivably control things besides note-on's on other synths. (I verified
     this from the first playing, as I had to turn down my wavestation's output, as it
     uses channel one itself.)

     Think I'll try some experiments...


     Terry Leigh Britton 


Hidden Sequencer in K5S?
 Wednesday, 17-Jun-98 04:33:18 writes:

      I read that you can playback MIDI files from disc by inserting it into the K5000s
      while the power is off, then hold down F1 while turning the power on. I
      tried this and nothing happened. Has anyone gotten this to work. They mentioned
      you can do this with software version 3.0, and thats what I'm using so I
      have no clue.

      I've been using a disc containing only one MID file. After powering up (holding
      down F1), the title screen remanes on, no music plays and it says "STOP" as
      a command over the F1 button, but pressing it doesn't do anything. F2 and F3
      when pressed scan the disc but they still don't play the MIDI file. F4 exits the
      demo playback mode. 

      David Beckman 


Re: Hidden Sequencer in K5S?
 Friday, 19-Jun-98 00:28:54 writes:

      I don't know why yours is not working. But, I can venture a guess: Since this
      plays to the Kawai's first four channels, does your midi sequence use any of the
      first four channels? Also, there was sysex in the demo songs that came with the
      K5000S, and several of these setup the K5000 for effects algorithms and
      such, and placed you into multi-mode. Be sure you are in multi mode manually.
      Also, be sure that the patches called by your midi sequence aren't empty
      slots in your K5000S. There's my first guesses.

      The sysex I analyzed was mostly for the effects, but there were other applications.
      The first [F0 7E 7F 09 01 F7] turns on General Midi (for the K5000W
      folks?). The next selects the Effects Algorithm. That is followed by the reverb
      type and parameters for that reverb. Then follows the effects types and their
      parameters for the four selected effects. Then the parameters for the EQ with
      settings for frequency bands 1 thru 7. Then there follows the assignments for
      the combis/multis effect path assignments (section 1, 2, 3, & 4) 

      Some of the demos include changes to the effects subs later during the sequence,
      and these are usually/often in conjunction with a patch-change message. Of
      course, there are controller messages as well. All this is in multi mode (which
      probably is entered automatically when playing a sequence/midi file from disk,
      as there was no special sysex message found to perform this change). Go into
      your sequencer and load the file your using and analyze it for proper channel
      and patch assignments, then fiddle with the effects by adding sysex to it
      yourself (there is no channel for sysex, so any track/channel will do for these
      insertions). The sysex numbers are in the programmers reference manual - for
      effects in combi/multi mode on page 33, and other useful controls on page 32
      - No checksums to be bothered with. Here's how those pages are utilized:

      For every parameter, you start with the same header:
      F0 40 00 10 00 0A 

      That is followed by 03 for the effects (all of page 33) or 04 for other parameters
      (all of page 32). This is referred to as 'sub 1' in the beginning of each
      chart/section. (Note: there is a typo in Effect Parameter - sub 05, value
      05h should read 'para 4' not 3.) Just stream out the numbers as listed, sub 1,
      sub 2 sub 3 and sub 4. Then the sub 5 number for the parameter thingy you are
      assigning a value to (listed under the sub5 item in the first column of each
      chart), and then the value you are assigning to it, high bit first and the low bit
      second. (This translates for all of these to [sub5 number] 00 [value in hex], since
      no high bit value is used in any of these except zero.) The numbers for the 'type'
      thingys in are listed on page ---- well, bust my buttons, they aren't
      listed in this book! Knock me off a hot tin roof! Here they are in the Owner's
      Manual on page 126! Reverbs of types zero thru 10 correspond to User's
      Manual Effects Parameter Types 1 thru 11, while Effects of types 11 thru 47
      correspond to User's Manual Effects Parameter Types 12 thru 48 (these are
      decimal: you'll have to pull out your scientific calculator to convert to
      hexadecimal to use in your sysex string. 00h thru 40h are used for Effects Types.)
      User's Manual column "Parameter 1" corresponds to the dry/wet parameter, 01h, and
      User's Manual Parameters 2-5 correspond to parameters 02h thru
      05h under the sub5 column. Aren't you glad you use Dial? Don't you wish
      everybody did? (Shameless plug for a deodorant soap brand....)

      Finally, cap it off with F7 and your done. So, an example follows for you to
      pick apart:

      F0 40 00 10 00 0A 03 00 04 00 00 00 23 F7

      (Ok, thats the header, sub1 = 03h Effect/EQ, sub2 = 00h Effect, sub3 = 04h
      Effect 4, sub4 = dummy (zero), sub5 = 00h type, high bit 00h, low bit 23 h
      (Effect 35 decimal plus 1 = 36, or phaser 1).

      Did I get it right???


Re: Hidden Sequencer in K5S?
 Friday, 19-Jun-98 00:59:18 writes:


      The elusive Combi Effect Path assignment is on page 32, COMBI section
      Parameter, in sub5, 03h.



 Re: Re: Hidden Sequencer in K5S?
 Monday, 22-Jun-98 22:17:43 writes:

      Another addendum: 

      It seems that the effects items explained are valid for either the multi/combi
      mode or for the single-play mode also. I just programmed my Peavey 1600X to
      do these sysex messages from sliders. If it works, I'll send up the four
      presets to Kenji.

      Also, if there is interest, I will send along two EMPTY banks (A & D) patches
      I made for starting fresh with all your memory available. (I think.)