The Eat at Joe's Kawai K5000 Message Board Digest
Out of Series Harmonics
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sound (re-)creation
Thursday, 27-Nov-97 08:17:06
Message:
194.109.41.238 writes:
I've read a lot about sound-synthesis lately and discovered that the best way (and
the most logical) is additive-synthesis. So naturally I turned my attention to
the K5000s'specs. I don't know if they were true, but it said that you could do
only whole numbered harmonics!!! Well I have two explanetions for that:1.
The engineers at Kawai are complete morons. or 2. It's too hard
for the k5000s' 32bit processor. So I hope the last, because if I told you that
most of the acoustic instruments have not-whole numbered harmonics (that is
the harmonics are not a whole numbered mulitple of the fundamental=pitch\note)
(yes even a pianosound !!) you would probably say too that those Kawai guys could
have made the perfect synthesizer! So to make the Kawai perfect
we could rewrite the K5000 internal soundengine-software. To do that you should
be probably a genuis in programming (since the K5000 works realtime
you must write it in it's processor-code!). What I would like to see implemented
is: 1. non whole numbered harmonics which can be tuned very, very precise
about 1/100 of a hertz 2. detailed pitch envelope 3.detailed phase envelope and
4. (optional) a second LFO if, of course, the k5000 first LFO isn't a
hardware LFO... So Anyone out there who can do that? Maybe you could even make
money with it?! (Hope that's a good motivation)
Now I have a request.... could someone mail this message to some sites? I've
just started working with the internet 2 months ago and still don't know a lot of
things and thus also don't know how to publish this message over the internet.
I would appriciate it!!! Think of that great potential this intsrument has and
could gain!!!
For further information about synthesis look for "syntheszer technique" (and
others) compiled from Keboard Magazine (USA)
Paul (Holland)
xeon@freemail.nl
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Re: sound (re-)creation
Thursday, 27-Nov-97 17:27:25
153.37.15.218 writes:
You can get harmonics that aren't in the series, but you need to add another source
(another set of oscillators) which contain the harmonic(s) you want in it's
series. Then you take out all of the harmonics in the harmonic level screen and
only add those (in)harmonics you want. If you detune the second source low
enough (or use the 65th-128th harmonics), the harmonics should be so close to
each other that you can get most of what you need (especially by fine detuning
the envelope, giving further accuracy in semitone percents). Granted this is
definately a work around of what could be implemented much better in a system
rewrite, and you'd need to do some math to get it right, but still I think with
six sources you could create a very complex waveform....
kenjib@rocketmail.com
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Re: sound (re-)creation
Friday, 28-Nov-97 00:46:02
199.86.47.8 writes:
The answer is 3.neither; you _can_ do non-whole number harnmonics.
While each additive generator "only" makes 64 whole-number harmonics, you can
combine up to 6 additive generators and they can start from 6 different
fundamentals. Each of the 6 generators has its own pitch envelope. There's no
phase control, but you can apply LFO in many ways, even to individual
harmonics. Each harmonic has it's own volume envelope.
Funny that you mention the piano--one of the guitar patches uses three additive
generators that start from different fundamentals (not octaves) and have
different pitch envelopes.
leiter@skypoint.com
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Combining Harmonics of Related Notes
Friday, 28-Nov-97 00:26:34
Message:
199.86.47.8 writes:
I've been getting some interesting sounds by combining the harmonics of different
notes, something that was suggested here. Generally, take 2 ADD
generators, remove the first few harmonics of the second one and offset it's
pitch by some inverval.
I've found that, to get a good sound, you have to be selective with the harmonics.
If you leave in too many of the harmonics on both generators it sounds like
playing an interval, instead of a single note with strange overtones. With close
intervals, it sounds like car horns in heavy traffic.
Also, tuning the interval can make a big difference. For example, if you tune
the 2d ADD down a major third, (-4 semitones), the 5th harmonic of the 2d
ADD almost matches the 4th of the primary note. In "just tuning", they would
be exactly the same, since the frequency of a major third is exactly 5/4 the
frequency of the tonic. But in the equal-tempered scale, they're off by 14
cents, which is around 16 on the K5k's fine tuning adjustment, so they sound out
of tune. When it's tuned, all of the new harmonics are in whole-number ratios
to the fundamental, like natural harmonics are. The tuning doesn't matter as
much with intervals of 4ths and 5ths because these are only off by 2 cents to
begin with.
The easiest way I've found to tune the interval is to turn down all the harmonics
except the two that should match and then tune them by ear (which is very
easy with pure sine waves). There are some weird combinations you can get this
way, e.g. matching up the 8th harmonic of the 2d ADD with the 7th of the
primary, or 7 with 6, etc.
leiter@skypoint.com
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Inharmonic Tones
Saturday, 27-Jun-98 17:29:51
209.160.126.117 writes:
This is a trick many of you probably already know, but I thought I would pass
it along anyway.
According to a book I have, "The Accoustical Foundations Of Music", vibrating
bar instruments, like the marimba, produce tones at the fundamental (1),
2.76 times the fundamental, and 5.40 times the fundamental.
In order to create this with my K5, I used two sources. I set the fundamental
of one source to the highest amplitude setting. I set its envelope to have a short
percussive decay. I then tuned the second source down 28 semitones. This had the
effect of dividing all of its harmonics by 5, so 5 became the fundamental,
10 became harmonic 2, 15 became harmonic 3 and so on. In order to get the
inharmonic tones, I turned up the 14 harmonic of the second source, which is
now 2.8 times the fundamental (not exact, but close enough). I then turned up
the 27 harmonic, which is 5.4 times the fundamental. I gave each harmonic a
percussive envelope like the fundamental only with shorter decays. To fine tune
the sound, you may want to raise the second source about 1/4 of a semitone.
Since you're only dealing with three harmonics, It's not hard to experiment with
setting them to different ampitudes till you get what you want.
You K5k owners out there can probably add attack transiets to spice up the sound.
There are probably other sounds that can be created this way as well. Let me know
if you know of any.
Leslie
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Re: Inharmonic Tones
Saturday, 27-Jun-98 20:00:11
199.86.40.80 writes:
It's good to see someone else is taking the textbook approach!
You could also set the fundamental of the second ADD to 2.76 times the fundamental
of the first. You can turn the 2.76 ratio into cents like this:
log(base 1.00057779)2.76 = 1758 cents
That's 18 half steps (course tuning) minus 42 cents, which is 42*63/50= 53
notches of fine tuning.
[1.00057779 is the ratio for one cent. Multiply a frequency by that number and
you move up one cent. It's equal to 2 to the 1/1200th.]
leiter
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